I guess I didn't get your message. I'll formulate a reply to this topic later.pseudo_opcode wrote: @G-Brain, man what you said is obvious, my message was the same, i think i m not clear enough, or from now i should say things directly, damn my english!!!
When too much is too much?
got it?
So far this discussion reveals a lot about the people writing in.
One point brought up was the lack of detail or completeness of hacking techniques discussed in the forums. You have to realize that a lot of the discussions assume that you already have basic knowledge of how computers and networks work. Sometimes a tutorial assumes that you have some college background in CIS or even programming. I also think sometimes tuts are left lacking certain crucial details because the author expects that only higher intellects would 'get the message'.
Another point mention that is part of this, is how people from all over the world get together in one place to talk about a complex subject. The words might be english, but the connotations, the sarcasm, the implications, etc, might be different.
I think we have talked A LOT about hacking in this forum, not just basic computer stuff. BTW, basic computer stuff is a part of hacking.
DNR
One point brought up was the lack of detail or completeness of hacking techniques discussed in the forums. You have to realize that a lot of the discussions assume that you already have basic knowledge of how computers and networks work. Sometimes a tutorial assumes that you have some college background in CIS or even programming. I also think sometimes tuts are left lacking certain crucial details because the author expects that only higher intellects would 'get the message'.
Another point mention that is part of this, is how people from all over the world get together in one place to talk about a complex subject. The words might be english, but the connotations, the sarcasm, the implications, etc, might be different.
I think we have talked A LOT about hacking in this forum, not just basic computer stuff. BTW, basic computer stuff is a part of hacking.
DNR
-
He gives wisdom to the wise and knowledge to the discerning. He reveals deep and hidden things; he knows what lies in Darkness, and Light dwells with him.
He gives wisdom to the wise and knowledge to the discerning. He reveals deep and hidden things; he knows what lies in Darkness, and Light dwells with him.
Oh my....is funny how one conversation about one subject takes you to another one, and in this case I say that's specially funny because first it was about too much information being exposed and ironically now is turning on into lack of hacking techniques 
A discussion in a forum like DNR says assumes a lot of things at times of writing, and yes there are a lot other that are left away, I think that is mostly because the fact that with any technique, there's a lot of things to know that are related to the technique itself, including general computer stuff or other wise assumed.
For instance, to create a very complete discussion about rooting a linux server, there have to be a lot of things to talk about not only the tools to be used and an attack vector, things like protocols will be important if you think on spoofing the attacker's IP or MAC, things like network topology at the victim side will be needed to help you to identify an attack vector and this is related then to assessment techniques, then is needed to know what the tools are and aren't capable to do, how the victim's network could react to one tool or another and how a tool can take advantage of that so you need to have an indepth knowledge of the tools, then what about victim's systems, you need to know very basic stuff like the commands you can use on it, how the log system works, what's being used to log your intrusion, how to clean your tracks, what you should be looking in order to do that cleaning...
So my point is that such a complete discussion isn't common because if someone is reading about 'rooting a linux server' then is assumed that the person have at least a basic knowledge about how to use linux, not only for hacking but general stuff aswell, is like making an intrusion in a FTP server and after that you don't know commands like dir, cd, delete, get, bye....trying to explain absolutly everything about one technique will be a very long thing to do
Every piece of knowledge is important because it has a purpose so I can't say I don't like the idea of talking about general computer stuff or hacking or cultures and how they interact or anything in between, from every discussion there's always something to learn
A discussion in a forum like DNR says assumes a lot of things at times of writing, and yes there are a lot other that are left away, I think that is mostly because the fact that with any technique, there's a lot of things to know that are related to the technique itself, including general computer stuff or other wise assumed.
For instance, to create a very complete discussion about rooting a linux server, there have to be a lot of things to talk about not only the tools to be used and an attack vector, things like protocols will be important if you think on spoofing the attacker's IP or MAC, things like network topology at the victim side will be needed to help you to identify an attack vector and this is related then to assessment techniques, then is needed to know what the tools are and aren't capable to do, how the victim's network could react to one tool or another and how a tool can take advantage of that so you need to have an indepth knowledge of the tools, then what about victim's systems, you need to know very basic stuff like the commands you can use on it, how the log system works, what's being used to log your intrusion, how to clean your tracks, what you should be looking in order to do that cleaning...
So my point is that such a complete discussion isn't common because if someone is reading about 'rooting a linux server' then is assumed that the person have at least a basic knowledge about how to use linux, not only for hacking but general stuff aswell, is like making an intrusion in a FTP server and after that you don't know commands like dir, cd, delete, get, bye....trying to explain absolutly everything about one technique will be a very long thing to do
Every piece of knowledge is important because it has a purpose so I can't say I don't like the idea of talking about general computer stuff or hacking or cultures and how they interact or anything in between, from every discussion there's always something to learn
-
computathug
- Administrator
- Posts: 2693
- Joined: 29 Mar 2007, 16:00
- 17
- Location: UK
- Contact:
uid wrote
Things must be written in order for it to live on. If information is not recorded then how can anyone learn from it or more to the point.... improved? From being a young age we learn how to store information and how to process it. Some of us have the luck of a free education system, where would we be without it?
What is right or wrong? Everything in life also needs an opponent. The good cop bad cop scenario. You can put this into perspective with every other. Its about gaining the power to stay on top. Knowledge is power. Information should be freely available or this would only mean that people from from certain backgrounds would get access to this. What would this mean....every company is a secret organization. The rich would get richer and the poorer get poorer.
Its not the information that's bad but the person holding it. The same could be said about a gun. Its only as dangerous as the person holding it. What is that persons frame of mind. Who are the people to judge this, what are there frame of minds. The questions and go on and on.
Everything we do is our own choice, if we are allowed to have the option. Yes i also agree that not everything should be out into the open for the world to see. On the other hand the world will always have its, cowboys and Indians, its cop's and robbers, and many many more we can all name. This is actually quite good for society or technology would not have had so much of a reason to grow if people were not learning new ideas and techniques and it shall continue to grow as more and more people can now become involved.
As in other replies, its how the brain works and how we interpret things. When some people open a book all they see is words where others will see the bugger picture. Place yourself in a busy place and what do you see? Do you just see people or do you see what each person is doing? Do you know where the cameras are and who is watching you? Did you see the guy looking at the old ladies handbag or the shoplifter looking for an easy target or the person who stops and shakes hands with another and secretly passes him a parcel. If you could stop the world and you could see it from the outside what would you see?
Everything is like this even in real life. Information is valuable but you need to have a certain amount of devotion, interest and time if you want to achieve anything. Without information this couldn't be achieved.
Enjoyed reading everyone's views, nice read
Everyday we learn something although we probably dont know it!Every piece of knowledge is important because it has a purpose so I can't say I don't like the idea of talking about general computer stuff or hacking or cultures and how they interact or anything in between, from every discussion there's always something to learn
Things must be written in order for it to live on. If information is not recorded then how can anyone learn from it or more to the point.... improved? From being a young age we learn how to store information and how to process it. Some of us have the luck of a free education system, where would we be without it?
What is right or wrong? Everything in life also needs an opponent. The good cop bad cop scenario. You can put this into perspective with every other. Its about gaining the power to stay on top. Knowledge is power. Information should be freely available or this would only mean that people from from certain backgrounds would get access to this. What would this mean....every company is a secret organization. The rich would get richer and the poorer get poorer.
Its not the information that's bad but the person holding it. The same could be said about a gun. Its only as dangerous as the person holding it. What is that persons frame of mind. Who are the people to judge this, what are there frame of minds. The questions and go on and on.
Everything we do is our own choice, if we are allowed to have the option. Yes i also agree that not everything should be out into the open for the world to see. On the other hand the world will always have its, cowboys and Indians, its cop's and robbers, and many many more we can all name. This is actually quite good for society or technology would not have had so much of a reason to grow if people were not learning new ideas and techniques and it shall continue to grow as more and more people can now become involved.
As in other replies, its how the brain works and how we interpret things. When some people open a book all they see is words where others will see the bugger picture. Place yourself in a busy place and what do you see? Do you just see people or do you see what each person is doing? Do you know where the cameras are and who is watching you? Did you see the guy looking at the old ladies handbag or the shoplifter looking for an easy target or the person who stops and shakes hands with another and secretly passes him a parcel. If you could stop the world and you could see it from the outside what would you see?
Everything is like this even in real life. Information is valuable but you need to have a certain amount of devotion, interest and time if you want to achieve anything. Without information this couldn't be achieved.
Enjoyed reading everyone's views, nice read
That reminds me that discussion about using google instead to think, one thing that was discussed there was the fact that at some point is imperative that information needs to be accessible because if not such information won't survive neither the knowledge that such information may offer so I agree with you computathug
I guess that even having sensitive information wide open isn't a big problem because as you said, the problem isn't the information but people who use it, there will be always someone who use it for good and those who don't and of course those who actually won't make any effort to embrase the information in hand and won't do anything with it
Sometimes I forget how strong is the influence of human behaviour above all things he he, I think as humans are the weakest chain in the security aspect is aswell the unstable base of information use
I guess that even having sensitive information wide open isn't a big problem because as you said, the problem isn't the information but people who use it, there will be always someone who use it for good and those who don't and of course those who actually won't make any effort to embrase the information in hand and won't do anything with it
Sometimes I forget how strong is the influence of human behaviour above all things he he, I think as humans are the weakest chain in the security aspect is aswell the unstable base of information use
-
Still_Learning
- Fame ! Where are the chicks?!
- Posts: 1040
- Joined: 11 Jun 2008, 16:00
- 15
- Location: Trigger City
<--- going back on topic
Information should not be controlled
mirrors.easynews.com/blackhat - http and ftp both avail
Do you know how long it would take someone to learn all of that!? There has to be a balance of both Black hat and White hat, so high paying jobs exist for us
btw; leech all you can now, server may not be up for much longer
Information should not be controlled
mirrors.easynews.com/blackhat - http and ftp both avail
Do you know how long it would take someone to learn all of that!? There has to be a balance of both Black hat and White hat, so high paying jobs exist for us
btw; leech all you can now, server may not be up for much longer